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Help[Facts] Re: Neo-Hebraic Interpolations...
in reply to a message by Noa
Thanks again for looking at these.
On JOHANNAH: all of my sources tell me that |-ah| is a feminine ending in Hebrew: Deborah, Hannah, Sarah, Zipporah, etc. (In the case of JONAH, the "AH" was not a suffix. The patriarch, NOAH, is actually |Noach| and there was an Israeli[th?] NOAH. [To Noa: is that your given name, or a cybernym?]
(See
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H5146&t=KJV and
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H5270&t=KJV )
I also thought that since |Chanan| & |Channah| were matched pairs
(See
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H2605&t=KJV and
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H2584&t=KJV ),
|Yowchanan| & |Yowchannah| (with two n's) would be matched pairs, too.
The JOHANNA's in Israel today probably did receive their names through European channels. But, as I see it, there are only two ways for the Greeks to have had a |Ioanna|:
On JOSHANA: I see what you mean, but the only information that we had at the time was the male name, JOSHUA, and http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G5614&t=KJV
"Like arrows in the hands of a warrior are sons born in one's youth." Ps. 127:4
JoHannah Jubilee, BenJudah Gabriel, Aaron Josiah, Jordan Uriah,
Maranatha Nissiah, (Anastasia Nike, 1992-1992), Jeshua David,
Shiloh Joshana, Elijah Daniel, Hezekiah Nathaniel, Zephaniah Joseph
On JOHANNAH: all of my sources tell me that |-ah| is a feminine ending in Hebrew: Deborah, Hannah, Sarah, Zipporah, etc. (In the case of JONAH, the "AH" was not a suffix. The patriarch, NOAH, is actually |Noach| and there was an Israeli[th?] NOAH. [To Noa: is that your given name, or a cybernym?]
(See
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H5146&t=KJV and
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H5270&t=KJV )
I also thought that since |Chanan| & |Channah| were matched pairs
(See
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H2605&t=KJV and
http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H2584&t=KJV ),
|Yowchanan| & |Yowchannah| (with two n's) would be matched pairs, too.
The JOHANNA's in Israel today probably did receive their names through European channels. But, as I see it, there are only two ways for the Greeks to have had a |Ioanna|:
- Grecize |Yowchanan| to |Ioannes| and feminize it, or
- Grecize an existing, unattested Hebrew feminine form of the name.
- The Greek feminine of |Ioannes| would have been |Ioanne|, where the given ending |-a| can be better explained as the Grecized Hebrew feminine ending |-ah|. (The Wikipedia article contradicts itself on that point.)
- I am guessing that, if she was Jewish, her first language and given name would have also been Jewish; that the Greek transcription required a Greek transliteration, just as it did when quoting [Torah] prophets and identifying other contemporary Jewish figures.
On JOSHANA: I see what you mean, but the only information that we had at the time was the male name, JOSHUA, and http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G5614&t=KJV
JoHannah Jubilee, BenJudah Gabriel, Aaron Josiah, Jordan Uriah,
Maranatha Nissiah, (Anastasia Nike, 1992-1992), Jeshua David,
Shiloh Joshana, Elijah Daniel, Hezekiah Nathaniel, Zephaniah Joseph
This message was edited 9/6/2014, 11:02 PM
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Replies
About Yochanna... could be. I'm not an expert on Hebrew names in those times, so it's possible there was a Hebrew female name linking Yochanan and Ioanna, especially with the sources you brought (I don't really know the New Testament, sorry). I think an actual expert/etymologist/historian should weigh in on this, because the fact that it makes sense for a name to exist doesn't automatically mean it existed. Anyway, even if it wasn't the actual historical link, I think it does make sense as a construct.
And yup, Noa is my given name (as in Zelophehad's daughter). :)
And yup, Noa is my given name (as in Zelophehad's daughter). :)
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http://www.hebrewnewtestament.com/aramaic.htm
This message was edited 9/7/2014, 12:01 AM
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This is from the Aramaic English New Testament ( http://www.hebrewnewtestament.com/ ),
http://www.messianic-torah-truth-seeker.org/Scriptures/Brit-Hadashah/Loukas/Loukas08.htm
http://www.messianic-torah-truth-seeker.org/Scriptures/Brit-Hadashah/Loukas/Loukas24.htm
Wouldn't that make YOCHANAH a Biblical Aramaic name, at least?
(I realize that the AENT is a recent work, but his source text is supposed to be very old. Supposedly, it is one generation after the original/lost Hebrew text, without having been translated to & from Greek, first.)
http://www.messianic-torah-truth-seeker.org/Scriptures/Brit-Hadashah/Loukas/Loukas08.htm
http://www.messianic-torah-truth-seeker.org/Scriptures/Brit-Hadashah/Loukas/Loukas24.htm
Wouldn't that make YOCHANAH a Biblical Aramaic name, at least?
(I realize that the AENT is a recent work, but his source text is supposed to be very old. Supposedly, it is one generation after the original/lost Hebrew text, without having been translated to & from Greek, first.)
This message was edited 9/7/2014, 6:12 AM
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Modern examples having two n's and ending in "h".
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCO_yqZF4LPO8HkV6_5g_1mg
https://www.facebook.com/yochannah
https://twitter.com/yochannah
Are these European-channel JOHANNA's who just added a final "h", or did they go to an older source?
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCO_yqZF4LPO8HkV6_5g_1mg
https://www.facebook.com/yochannah
https://twitter.com/yochannah
Are these European-channel JOHANNA's who just added a final "h", or did they go to an older source?
This message was edited 9/7/2014, 11:47 PM
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