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ArchivesRe: MN spelling issue-Noel
in reply to a message by anxiolytics
Noel, pronounced "nole," is an English boy's name. Example: Noel Coward, the playwright.
Noe"l, with two dots over the e, pronounced "no-ELL," is the French word for Christmas. Example: The First Noe"l. I love this for a girl. I'm used to seasonal / temporal names like Autumn, Spring, Winter, Summer used for girls, so to me Noe"l falls right in line with this.
Noelle is made up. Don't care for it at all.
The Jean / Jeanne thing is apples and oranges. Not the same situation at all. Jean is the French form of John. Jean is also the Scottish form of Jane (from John). Both Jean for a boy and Jean for a girl are quite defensible, historically speaking.
Noe"l, with two dots over the e, pronounced "no-ELL," is the French word for Christmas. Example: The First Noe"l. I love this for a girl. I'm used to seasonal / temporal names like Autumn, Spring, Winter, Summer used for girls, so to me Noe"l falls right in line with this.
Noelle is made up. Don't care for it at all.
The Jean / Jeanne thing is apples and oranges. Not the same situation at all. Jean is the French form of John. Jean is also the Scottish form of Jane (from John). Both Jean for a boy and Jean for a girl are quite defensible, historically speaking.
This message was edited 10/24/2007, 3:43 PM
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Replies
No.
Noëlle is the french feminine form of the french (not english) male name Noël.
Made up in a way all feminine french names ending on -le have been made up from a masculin name ending in "el", or "ël" in this case :)
Noëlle is the french feminine form of the french (not english) male name Noël.
Made up in a way all feminine french names ending on -le have been made up from a masculin name ending in "el", or "ël" in this case :)
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Not all French feminine names with an *el* sound at the end end in "-elle." Example: Adele, Gisele.
Noelle is a made up "Americanized" French name. No one in France would use it.
The only reason Noe"l (with two dots, I'm hopeless at fancy accent marks on my computer) *feels* feminine to me is the analogy to Spring, Summer, Autumn and Winter in English. Since the proper way to spell the word Christmas in French is with the two dots, that's why I include them in the name.
Noel, without the two dots, pronounced "nole" is definitely an English boy's name. It obviously comes from French, but the Brits have adapted it into their usage this way. Noel Coward, if you have never heard of HIM, is a famous playwright. He is just one of many British MEN with the name.
I never said Noel without two dots was a valid French spelling. If you re-read my post you'll see that I specifically denoted it as an English (male) variant of the French word.
Noelle is a made up "Americanized" French name. No one in France would use it.
The only reason Noe"l (with two dots, I'm hopeless at fancy accent marks on my computer) *feels* feminine to me is the analogy to Spring, Summer, Autumn and Winter in English. Since the proper way to spell the word Christmas in French is with the two dots, that's why I include them in the name.
Noel, without the two dots, pronounced "nole" is definitely an English boy's name. It obviously comes from French, but the Brits have adapted it into their usage this way. Noel Coward, if you have never heard of HIM, is a famous playwright. He is just one of many British MEN with the name.
I never said Noel without two dots was a valid French spelling. If you re-read my post you'll see that I specifically denoted it as an English (male) variant of the French word.
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>Not all French feminine names with an *el* sound at the end end in "-elle." Example: Adele, Gisele.
you're right. I wasn't saying that all french names on -el were made up the same way. But I wanted to say that "Noelle" isn't any more made up than f.ex. Michelle, Danielle, Emanuelle or Gabrielle. Because ...
>Noelle is a made up "Americanized" French name. No one in France would use it.
This is not the case. It has been made up in France. Since in France "Noël" is male and male only. So when the word "Noël" turned into a first name, they came up with "Noëlle" as the female variant.
I know there are female names that have been "french"-isized outside of France by adding -elle or -le (or -ette), but Noëlle isn't one of them. That's what I wanted to say :)
In fact, using Noël or Noel as female names is the "americanized" way.
you're right. I wasn't saying that all french names on -el were made up the same way. But I wanted to say that "Noelle" isn't any more made up than f.ex. Michelle, Danielle, Emanuelle or Gabrielle. Because ...
>Noelle is a made up "Americanized" French name. No one in France would use it.
This is not the case. It has been made up in France. Since in France "Noël" is male and male only. So when the word "Noël" turned into a first name, they came up with "Noëlle" as the female variant.
I know there are female names that have been "french"-isized outside of France by adding -elle or -le (or -ette), but Noëlle isn't one of them. That's what I wanted to say :)
In fact, using Noël or Noel as female names is the "americanized" way.
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Noëlle
Noëlle is not a made up "Americanized" French name.
It was used mainly in Middle Ages, just as other Christian/Catholic feasts (Toussaint, Tiphaine, Noël...) and just as in other European languages (Nadal/Nadala in Catalan, Natal or Epifanio/Epifania/Epifanía in Spanish, etc.). After this age, the name (and the masculine Noël) fell in popularity and it was recuperated in 20th century for use (also in the compound Marie-Noëlle).
It had a moment of splendour in '40s-'70s, with a zenith year in 1949, with 1,095 new-born girls named Noëlle.
At the begin of 2006, a total of 24,453 girls in France were named Noëlle.
Noëlle is not a made up "Americanized" French name.
It was used mainly in Middle Ages, just as other Christian/Catholic feasts (Toussaint, Tiphaine, Noël...) and just as in other European languages (Nadal/Nadala in Catalan, Natal or Epifanio/Epifania/Epifanía in Spanish, etc.). After this age, the name (and the masculine Noël) fell in popularity and it was recuperated in 20th century for use (also in the compound Marie-Noëlle).
It had a moment of splendour in '40s-'70s, with a zenith year in 1949, with 1,095 new-born girls named Noëlle.
At the begin of 2006, a total of 24,453 girls in France were named Noëlle.
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Thank you for responding!
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Is Noëlle used as a name in France?
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