New Post
Search
HelpRe: Pleasant for a boy
in reply to a message by Array
I am in disbelief this is actually considered a name. A word? Is this not what we all hope our children would be? It is an awful idea. I am not sure what male would want their middle name to be Pleasant. Could you imagine him in the locker room with all of his buddies and how embarrassed he would be if the topic of middle names ever arose? He would change it to Paul to spare his dignity and manhood.
Archived Thread - replies disabled
1
Replies
You know what?
I like word names. I like them a lot. But Pleasant isn't simply a nice-sounding word I found in the dictionary--it has a great deal of history.
Alvin Pleasant Delaney Carter. Go look him up sometime.
I'll leave the question of what my theoretical son (I'm glad you know his personality so well, btw--someone oughta, and a stranger on the internet would be my first choice) would do out of this, along with the question of "dignity and manhood" (because I go to a very liberal women's college and don't have the time for sexist crap like that, thanks--we talk it up enough in class). That's not what I have a problem with.
I'm most bothered by the fact that that you think Pleasant can't be a name because it's a word. Never mind that it's a word with a history of use--you've never heard it before, and therefore, it's no good.
Pull your head out your ass, please and thank you.
Array (gets defensive about word names)
I like word names. I like them a lot. But Pleasant isn't simply a nice-sounding word I found in the dictionary--it has a great deal of history.
Alvin Pleasant Delaney Carter. Go look him up sometime.
I'll leave the question of what my theoretical son (I'm glad you know his personality so well, btw--someone oughta, and a stranger on the internet would be my first choice) would do out of this, along with the question of "dignity and manhood" (because I go to a very liberal women's college and don't have the time for sexist crap like that, thanks--we talk it up enough in class). That's not what I have a problem with.
I'm most bothered by the fact that that you think Pleasant can't be a name because it's a word. Never mind that it's a word with a history of use--you've never heard it before, and therefore, it's no good.
Pull your head out your ass, please and thank you.
Array (gets defensive about word names)
1
I'll tell you what.
I am in awe that one person's opinion could impact your demeanor to this degree. That is wonderful you like word names, but I do not. And that is exactly what you requested - opinions on the male middle name Pleasant, is it not? If you cannot handle other's opinions on a name you like, why bother asking for them? Next time, please request only positive feedback from brown nosers if that is so what you desire. I for one am not going to fluff up my response for the sake of your feelings on a name that you feel so strongly about. Please do not waste everyone's time next time if you do not want honest responses.
I am in awe that one person's opinion could impact your demeanor to this degree. That is wonderful you like word names, but I do not. And that is exactly what you requested - opinions on the male middle name Pleasant, is it not? If you cannot handle other's opinions on a name you like, why bother asking for them? Next time, please request only positive feedback from brown nosers if that is so what you desire. I for one am not going to fluff up my response for the sake of your feelings on a name that you feel so strongly about. Please do not waste everyone's time next time if you do not want honest responses.
1
giving your honest opinion is one thing
Expressing it in a snide, wise-ass, superior, over-the-top manner, like it actually affects your happiness what name Array happens to like, is quite another thing.
She doesn't mind that you disagree with her. I disagree with her pretty frequently in matters of names, but we still get along just fine. I think what she objected to was the obnoxious, overdramatic way you responded to her.
Expressing it in a snide, wise-ass, superior, over-the-top manner, like it actually affects your happiness what name Array happens to like, is quite another thing.
She doesn't mind that you disagree with her. I disagree with her pretty frequently in matters of names, but we still get along just fine. I think what she objected to was the obnoxious, overdramatic way you responded to her.
1
Holy cow.
You're really new around here, aren't you?
My favourite names include Morpheus, Horatio, Evening, and Ruxandra. I've had plenty of people tell me that they're horrible. I've had friends IRL tell me that if I ever call a daughter Evening, the only present she'll ever get from them is a jar of night air.
If you think my demeanor has been 'impacted' (impact isn't a verb, by the way) by your opinion, you haven't been paying much attention. I am, at the most, mildly annoyed at the fact that you don't seem to understand that your narrow view of the world may not even slightly correspond with mine--or with my theoretical children's.
Maybe the part where you've been a dismissive, ignorant asshole that has my dander up a bit, but I'm certainly not crying at my computer screen right now. I'm sorry to disappoint you.
Array
Edited to make a sentence make more sense.
You're really new around here, aren't you?
My favourite names include Morpheus, Horatio, Evening, and Ruxandra. I've had plenty of people tell me that they're horrible. I've had friends IRL tell me that if I ever call a daughter Evening, the only present she'll ever get from them is a jar of night air.
If you think my demeanor has been 'impacted' (impact isn't a verb, by the way) by your opinion, you haven't been paying much attention. I am, at the most, mildly annoyed at the fact that you don't seem to understand that your narrow view of the world may not even slightly correspond with mine--or with my theoretical children's.
Maybe the part where you've been a dismissive, ignorant asshole that has my dander up a bit, but I'm certainly not crying at my computer screen right now. I'm sorry to disappoint you.
Array
Edited to make a sentence make more sense.
This message was edited 2/11/2007, 10:27 AM
1
What does being new around here have anything to do with my ability to express an opinion on a name, an opinion you requested? I merely stated that if you did not want opinions, you should not ask for them. Harmless response, really. Not everyone has the same flavour of names which is expected, but the bottom line is I gave you my opinion and you have showed how poorly you handle honest opinions. I feel my time has been wasted and I will no longer respond to any of your posts.
1
What does being new around here have anything to do with my ability to express an opinion on a name, an opinion you requested?
It's relevant because if you truly believe that Array has no desire to hear honest criticism, then clearly you know absolutely nothing about her.
I gave you my opinion and you have showed how poorly you handle honest opinions.
No. You gave your opinion in an excessively dramatic and somewhat inflammatory manner, and Array responded accordingly.
It's relevant because if you truly believe that Array has no desire to hear honest criticism, then clearly you know absolutely nothing about her.
I gave you my opinion and you have showed how poorly you handle honest opinions.
No. You gave your opinion in an excessively dramatic and somewhat inflammatory manner, and Array responded accordingly.
1
It wasnt your opinion that was objected to it was the way you expressed that opinion.
1
I feel my time has been wasted and I will no longer respond to any of your posts.
Good, because your sheer dumbassery, sir or madam, has wasted mine.
Good day.
Array
Good, because your sheer dumbassery, sir or madam, has wasted mine.
Good day.
Array
1
Actually, I was wondering if I could get them to make that same promise to me...
1
That would be nice, wouldn't it?
I'm all for dissenting opinions, but it'd be nice if we could play nice like grownups.
Array
I'm all for dissenting opinions, but it'd be nice if we could play nice like grownups.
Array
1
Actually
As a writer, I would just like to point out that impact is indeed a verb. Look it up.
As a writer, I would just like to point out that impact is indeed a verb. Look it up.
1
Who are you and on what grounds do you think can be so rude? Array is a long standing, well respected member of our commmunity. You do not even have an account.
If people say they don't like a name, she is generally fine about it, not that you'd know since I've never seen you here before, but you delivered your message of dislike with such ignorance and rudeness that it is understandable why she replied so vehemently.
If people say they don't like a name, she is generally fine about it, not that you'd know since I've never seen you here before, but you delivered your message of dislike with such ignorance and rudeness that it is understandable why she replied so vehemently.
This message was edited 2/11/2007, 10:22 AM
1
I am Tota and I will freely express my opinion, regardless of how "new" or "old" to this site I may be. This does not make my threads/posts any less valid than anyone else's. My post was an opinion and one that I did not find to be rude or ignorant. I was also not aware that this site permitted personal attacks. Moreover, I am not responsible for one's perceptions of what they read or choose to read.
1
That attitude + ditto Akis
It's a shame how we think it's cute for a girl to be named Hunter or Dylan, very "manly" names, but Pleasant would destroy someone's "dignity and manhood." Such double standards. Ew.
It's a shame how we think it's cute for a girl to be named Hunter or Dylan, very "manly" names, but Pleasant would destroy someone's "dignity and manhood." Such double standards. Ew.
This message was edited 2/11/2007, 9:59 AM
1
i TOTALLY agree
1
SING IT.
1
Who is "we" who thinks it is cute for a girl to be named Hunter or Dylan? If there are people naming their daughters this, then let's start naming our sons Helga and Elisabeth. You go first.
1
For my reply to "we", please see my answer to Kris Rose.
And yes, there are people naming their daughters that. Click: Hunter. Note it's even been given the "feminine" designation since the trend is so prevalent. There was just a discussion of the feminization of Dylan in a thread yesterday, but you can scroll for that yourself.
And that's the point I'm trying to make -- it is socially acceptable to name girls that, but it's scandalous to consider Helga or Elisabeth for a boy.
And yes, there are people naming their daughters that. Click: Hunter. Note it's even been given the "feminine" designation since the trend is so prevalent. There was just a discussion of the feminization of Dylan in a thread yesterday, but you can scroll for that yourself.
And that's the point I'm trying to make -- it is socially acceptable to name girls that, but it's scandalous to consider Helga or Elisabeth for a boy.
1
I assure you I am not one for male names on females, and vice versa. Pleasant is a word I associate with behaviours and attitude. "Good" behaviours have always been expected from women - as is being "Nice" and "Polite", etc. This can extend to the colour "Blue" for boys and the colour "Pink" for girls. Sexist labels, if you will. These are the differences evoked upon males and females, regardless of how much you choose to disagree. This would help explain my thoughts on the name Pleasant and my example of the locker room, coming from an individual who does not applaude the use of the names Hunter, Dylan, James, Robert, on females (nor the use of words).
1
Actually
I loathe Hunter, Dylan, even Mackenzie, Avery, Ashley, Bailey, Sidney for a girl, and love them on a boy.
I understand where you are coming from, but some people here dont exactly like boy names crossing the line.
At the same time, I really just dislike all word names. I only added the bit about a man because I got into it last night with a friend. Besides, in our society, females crossing the line into masculinity is more acceptable then vice versa.
Yes, I agree that if we allow one, we should allow the other. And some here may have that double standard, but dont assume all of us do.
I loathe Hunter, Dylan, even Mackenzie, Avery, Ashley, Bailey, Sidney for a girl, and love them on a boy.
I understand where you are coming from, but some people here dont exactly like boy names crossing the line.
At the same time, I really just dislike all word names. I only added the bit about a man because I got into it last night with a friend. Besides, in our society, females crossing the line into masculinity is more acceptable then vice versa.
Yes, I agree that if we allow one, we should allow the other. And some here may have that double standard, but dont assume all of us do.
This message was edited 2/11/2007, 10:03 AM
1
everybody needs to keep in mind...
That most of those so-called "male names on females" were never commonly used on males till very recently. Sidney is an exception, it's been used as a fn for men for a few hundred years, and on women almost as long.
Avery, Mackenzie, Tyler, Dylan, Bailye... these were rarely given as ffirst names at all, unless they were family names. IT wasn't till about thirty years ago when Tyle r, Brandon and Ryan were used as fns at all. Dylan was almost unheard of when Dylan Thomas's parents chose it for him, it was a very minor character in Welsh mythology and was originally supposed to be pronounced Dullan. But Thomas's parents didn't know this.
I don't think it's very accurate to call names like Bailey, Avery, Mackenzie, etc, traditional male names. They haven't been fns long enough to be traditional anything.
And it is highly unlikely that truly traditional male names like James, John, Edward, etc, will ever be given to girls by more than a very few iconoclastic parents. Just as truly traditional girls' names like Maria, Jane and Elizabeth are not going to wind up on more than a very few boys.
Pleasant is not just an adjective. IT is a place name and a last name. As a last name, it is fair game to be picked up as a first or middle name.
That most of those so-called "male names on females" were never commonly used on males till very recently. Sidney is an exception, it's been used as a fn for men for a few hundred years, and on women almost as long.
Avery, Mackenzie, Tyler, Dylan, Bailye... these were rarely given as ffirst names at all, unless they were family names. IT wasn't till about thirty years ago when Tyle r, Brandon and Ryan were used as fns at all. Dylan was almost unheard of when Dylan Thomas's parents chose it for him, it was a very minor character in Welsh mythology and was originally supposed to be pronounced Dullan. But Thomas's parents didn't know this.
I don't think it's very accurate to call names like Bailey, Avery, Mackenzie, etc, traditional male names. They haven't been fns long enough to be traditional anything.
And it is highly unlikely that truly traditional male names like James, John, Edward, etc, will ever be given to girls by more than a very few iconoclastic parents. Just as truly traditional girls' names like Maria, Jane and Elizabeth are not going to wind up on more than a very few boys.
Pleasant is not just an adjective. IT is a place name and a last name. As a last name, it is fair game to be picked up as a first or middle name.
1
Obviously my post was meant in a general way. I don't even know if Tota likes Dylan or Hunter or Sally Anne or whatever. My post was meant to highlight a failure in society in general.
+ I said "we", and anyone who has seen me post for any length of time knows that I dislike Dylan or Madison or whatever on girls, so it couldn't possibly have been meant literally like you're taking it.
+ I said "we", and anyone who has seen me post for any length of time knows that I dislike Dylan or Madison or whatever on girls, so it couldn't possibly have been meant literally like you're taking it.
This message was edited 2/11/2007, 10:07 AM
1
I figured you meant in a general sense, but I doubt the fact that anyone who has a problem with Pleasant as a boys name is doing it because they are sexist in a way that their thinking says females can have masculine names but males cant have feminine names. Its simply we like names to be on their original/traditional gender or we simply dont like word names in general.
1
That may be true for you (liking traditional gender and not word names), and it may be partly true for Tota, but s/he makes it pretty clear that there is a sexist issue going on with the comment about dignity and manhood being robbed by, horror of horrors, Pleasant as a MN. Even if s/he also dislikes boys names on girls, it is still ass backwards to assume that one's dignity and manhood lie in the balance over a MN that as a word would be considered ungendered but the poster perceived as not masculine enough for a locker room discussion (and we all know that locker room discussions define the man).
1
The locker room was an example. In my opinion, the name Pleasant is a word, and not one I would immeidately associate with use on a male. I am also sure it is not a name the general population would find appealing as name for either gender. It is moreso a word than name, and as ridiculous as the words Jolly or Charming being used.
1
You are continuously referring to this man with the word Pleasant as a name. Has it occurred to you or anyone that perhaps his parents enjoyed random words? This does not automatically make it a legit name. Let's take Nevaeh for example. Pleasant is not even listed on this site. What is this to say of its legitimacy?
1
Actually Pleasant is a surname as well as a word and at one time it was very common for children to be given their mothers maiden name or other family surnames as middle names or even as first names.
Many of the names were use today started out as surnames.
Many of the names were use today started out as surnames.
1
You are continuously referring to this man with the word Pleasant as a name. Has it occurred to you or anyone that perhaps his parents enjoyed random words?
LN: Carter
DH: Robert
DW: Mollie Bays
DS: Alvin Pleasant (Pleasant or A.P.)
DS: Jim
DS/DD: Ezra "Eck", Virgie
DS: Grant
DD: Ettaleen
DS: Ermine
DD: Sylvia
I'm going to say no, his parents weren't all out on random words, based on his family. BTW, I enjoy the way you refer to him as "this man," as though he's some random footnote in a genealogy. "This man" changed the face of popular music forever.
And Nevaeh is now a name, whether you like it or not. I don't like it, but that fact doesn't mean it isn't "real".
Besides that, quite a few legitimate names aren't listed on this site. Is Galatea no longer a name? (We'd better inform Pygmalion.) How about Hanorah? (All those 19th century Irishwomen just had dumbasses for parents.) Lisetta? (That's one of my ancestors, right there.) Bendicht? (And another one.) Langston? (Mr. Hughes would likely be disappointed if you told us his name was a lie.) So, sorry, that argument doesn't hold up. Please try again.
Array
LN: Carter
DH: Robert
DW: Mollie Bays
DS: Alvin Pleasant (Pleasant or A.P.)
DS: Jim
DS/DD: Ezra "Eck", Virgie
DS: Grant
DD: Ettaleen
DS: Ermine
DD: Sylvia
I'm going to say no, his parents weren't all out on random words, based on his family. BTW, I enjoy the way you refer to him as "this man," as though he's some random footnote in a genealogy. "This man" changed the face of popular music forever.
And Nevaeh is now a name, whether you like it or not. I don't like it, but that fact doesn't mean it isn't "real".
Besides that, quite a few legitimate names aren't listed on this site. Is Galatea no longer a name? (We'd better inform Pygmalion.) How about Hanorah? (All those 19th century Irishwomen just had dumbasses for parents.) Lisetta? (That's one of my ancestors, right there.) Bendicht? (And another one.) Langston? (Mr. Hughes would likely be disappointed if you told us his name was a lie.) So, sorry, that argument doesn't hold up. Please try again.
Array
1
As it happens...
There are men for whom the epitome of manhood and dignity is not found in a locker room with a crowd of the foul and obnoxious buddies you're imagining. Actually, I'd guess it's the majority of men. I think the "teased by childhood peers" angle that gets thrown at names that aren't butch enough is way overblown.
There are men for whom the epitome of manhood and dignity is not found in a locker room with a crowd of the foul and obnoxious buddies you're imagining. Actually, I'd guess it's the majority of men. I think the "teased by childhood peers" angle that gets thrown at names that aren't butch enough is way overblown.
1
PS
Pleasant (male mn) makes me smile. See also: Darling (female mn).
Pleasant (male mn) makes me smile. See also: Darling (female mn).
1
PSS
Out of sheer curiosity, would the hypothetical male middle names Charming, Peachy, Jolly, Delightful, Kind, and Likeable be to your liking and make you smile as well?
Out of sheer curiosity, would the hypothetical male middle names Charming, Peachy, Jolly, Delightful, Kind, and Likeable be to your liking and make you smile as well?
1
Wow, rude much?
1
Er..
I don't like every adjective equally, no.
(Was this some kinda trick question?)
I don't like every adjective equally, no.
(Was this some kinda trick question?)
1
Sheer curiosity, my friend.
1
Why wouldn't they be?
f
f
1
I don't like it either.
1
Agree
I really dislike word names, and even though it is a mn, I would discourage it. How often guys get on to subjects such as middle names and meanings of names I dont know. However, I do know a guy with a twin brother whose name means butterfly, and he always makes something up when asked what his name means, because he doesnt want to say it means butterfly. I think mn Pleasant would be similar - he would say his mn is Paul or something along those lines to protect his "true identity" so to speak.
I really dislike word names, and even though it is a mn, I would discourage it. How often guys get on to subjects such as middle names and meanings of names I dont know. However, I do know a guy with a twin brother whose name means butterfly, and he always makes something up when asked what his name means, because he doesnt want to say it means butterfly. I think mn Pleasant would be similar - he would say his mn is Paul or something along those lines to protect his "true identity" so to speak.
1