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Help[Facts] Re: Double meaning of Alfred? Male, German
in reply to a message by Dorchadas
Thanks Dorchadas! Yes, I did think that the case I was asking about was mostly in the German-speaking world, but I was also wondering if It may be derived in the anglophone world through æðel and another Anglo-Saxon element. Although I can't find one. Is there an Old English cognate of "frid"? Or did that never exist?
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Old English certainly had a cognate for the ancient Germanic element frid! It was friþ (later spelled as frith):
https://www.behindthename.com/element/frith31
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/fri%C3%BEuz#Descendants
I see the Old English cognate of Adalfrid is even in the main database of this website already, I hadn't thought to look for that yesterday evening (as I was tired and about to go to bed). Here it is: Æðelfrið. It looks like the name was rarely used after the Norman conquest in 1066, so I guess that's why Alfred as a variant of Æðelfrið never took off (or eventually became well-known) in England. It might already have existed before then (perhaps rarely), but died off together with Æðelfrið.
https://www.behindthename.com/element/frith31
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/fri%C3%BEuz#Descendants
I see the Old English cognate of Adalfrid is even in the main database of this website already, I hadn't thought to look for that yesterday evening (as I was tired and about to go to bed). Here it is: Æðelfrið. It looks like the name was rarely used after the Norman conquest in 1066, so I guess that's why Alfred as a variant of Æðelfrið never took off (or eventually became well-known) in England. It might already have existed before then (perhaps rarely), but died off together with Æðelfrið.
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Wow, interesting Dorchadas. Thanks!
So, if Æðelfrið started to fall out of use after the Norman conquest, is it possible that the Normans imported the Adalfrid cognate to England? Like how Hrodger was imported, replacing Hroðgar, and how Hrodebert replaced Hreodbeorht. Could the same process have brought Adalfrid to England, replacing Æðelfrið and then derived Alfred from Adalfrid in some cases later?
So, if Æðelfrið started to fall out of use after the Norman conquest, is it possible that the Normans imported the Adalfrid cognate to England? Like how Hrodger was imported, replacing Hroðgar, and how Hrodebert replaced Hreodbeorht. Could the same process have brought Adalfrid to England, replacing Æðelfrið and then derived Alfred from Adalfrid in some cases later?
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This is technically possible, given the fact that this happened to more names than the ones that you listed as an example. I don't know whether Adalfrid or Æðelfrið is one of them, however. You would have to try to verify this yourself using scientific literature about names in medieval England (especially after the Norman conquest). If it turns out that this has not been documented, then likely this has either never happened or has simply not been researched yet.
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Alfred in English use is almost always derived from Alfred the Great. However Alfred is a Latinised abbreviation (in coinage Ælfred). His real name was Æþelfriþ, son of Æþelwulf, and brother of Æþelræd, Æþelberht, Æþelbald, Æþelstan and Æþelswiþ, his daughters were Æþelflæd, Æþelgifu and his son Æþelweard (he had another daughter, whose name is unclear, it is recorded as Elfreda [Æþelfreoþu] and Elstrudis [Æþelþryþ?]). The Wiktionary derivation is a folk-etymology, but an early one — within two generations both Æþel- and Ælf- are recorded as the first element of names in this family, although there is confusion as to who is who, and some forms are known only from much later copies of charters or letters and may have been "corrected" later.
This message was edited 2/7/2019, 4:14 AM
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