Audoflède and Bertheflède
I have recently discovered these Old French names, and have been puzzling over their origin.
Their first elements look to me like the Germanic elements "aud" and "beraht", but I can't be sure, and their shared second element is a complete mystery to me.
I would love to hear any ideas you might have which would explain this!
Their first elements look to me like the Germanic elements "aud" and "beraht", but I can't be sure, and their shared second element is a complete mystery to me.
I would love to hear any ideas you might have which would explain this!
Replies
THAT'S FRENCH???? I'm French and aghast.
This is not the opinions board so please don't give opinions.
*FLAD is another Germanic name element, meaning "beauty, cleanness, purity". It was specially popular among the Anglo-Saxons (where it became FLED due to sound change). The German word #unflätig# "indescent, bawdy" is a reflex of this root.
This message was edited 4/25/2016, 6:15 AM
Audofleda and Bertefleda are recorded Frankish names, so Audoflède and Bertheflède would be direct adaptations into modern French, without intervening modification. Unflat "dirt, filth" from Middle High German unvlat "dirtiness, untidiness" and unflätig (also "dirty, nasty") from MHG unvlætic "unclean, untidy" are the only certain cognates of *flad in prosaic use, although Norse fleða “sleek” seems likely (if an earlier meaning was something like "trim, tidy"). Norse fljóð "woman", sometimes suggested, appears to be a kenning inspired by the un-related fljót "fleet".
*FLAD indeed means beauty, cleanlyness. In High German there was another sound shift, so the outcome of common Germanic *flad is FLAT in High German (and Kuhfladen has nothing to do with it, it is named because of its flattened form, there also Fladenbrot that is eatable).
Here you can read the details: http://woerterbuchnetz.de/DWB/?sigle=DWB&mode=Vernetzung&lemid=GF05296#XGF05296 and http://woerterbuchnetz.de/DWB/?sigle=DWB&mode=Vernetzung&lemid=GF05294#XGF05294 and http://woerterbuchnetz.de/DWB/?sigle=DWB&mode=Vernetzung&lemid=GF05049#XGF05049
Here you can read the details: http://woerterbuchnetz.de/DWB/?sigle=DWB&mode=Vernetzung&lemid=GF05296#XGF05296 and http://woerterbuchnetz.de/DWB/?sigle=DWB&mode=Vernetzung&lemid=GF05294#XGF05294 and http://woerterbuchnetz.de/DWB/?sigle=DWB&mode=Vernetzung&lemid=GF05049#XGF05049
Hi elbowin,
No offense but it is it really necessary to keep answering questions I've already answered, with virtually the same answer? It's kinda irritating.
No offense but it is it really necessary to keep answering questions I've already answered, with virtually the same answer? It's kinda irritating.
What is the harm in Elbowin wanting to make his or her own contribution of help to the original poster? What does it matter if their contribution partially contained information that you had already provided? He or she might perhaps have thought, as a native German (assuming the information in their profile is correct), that their contribution contained some additional information that "fine-tuned" things further. I see no harm in that - it is better to have a lot of information than to have very little at all, even if that means that some bits are repeated here and there. I personally believe that it is rather stifling (perhaps even reminiscent of censorship) to try to create an atmosphere here where a user is discouraged from making a contribution when their contribution is (partially) going to contain similar information that an other user has already provided.... where a user is discouraged from expanding on information that is already provided. Keep that up and you will find that this board, which is already fairly silent to begin with (at least when compared to the other message boards on BtN), will eventually go dead. At least, I can't see how people would want to take the time and effort to help someone with their question when there is a negative atmosphere of this kind on the board... an atmosphere where you basically shouldn't touch a question when it has already been "touched" by an other user. This board shouldn't be some kind of "I was here first so go find some other thread to reply to!" kind of contest or whatever. That is not scientific (nor particularly inviting or welcoming, for that matter) and will thus hurt the scientific aims of this board.
With that said, it is unfortunate that Elbowin's apparent eagerness to help appears to have caused some offence on your part, but I doubt that their actions were intentional or purely aimed at offending you. For one thing, they appear to be a long-time user (according to their profile) and I doubt that long-time users (who in my experience so far always have a respectable reputation) would resort to petty things such as that.
With that said, it is unfortunate that Elbowin's apparent eagerness to help appears to have caused some offence on your part, but I doubt that their actions were intentional or purely aimed at offending you. For one thing, they appear to be a long-time user (according to their profile) and I doubt that long-time users (who in my experience so far always have a respectable reputation) would resort to petty things such as that.
...
I asked a simple question about the repetitive responses in this thread, you've responded with a highly emotive and hyperbolic wall-of-text, and *I* am the one creating drama?
Maybe you should take your own advice ;)
I asked a simple question about the repetitive responses in this thread, you've responded with a highly emotive and hyperbolic wall-of-text, and *I* am the one creating drama?
Maybe you should take your own advice ;)
Kuhfladen means 'cowpat' - literally translated, 'cow flatbread'. The 'flad' in this word is from the Proto-Germanic 'flata' meaning 'flat', not from the Anglo-Saxon 'flaed'.
These are quite likely to be Anglo-Saxon in origin. The shared element is flæd (http://www.behindthename.com/element/flae32d).
Elfleda is a modernised name with the same element.
Elfleda is a modernised name with the same element.
Thank you, that clears it up!