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ArchivesRe: Okay, serious confusion searching online about this name...
in reply to a message by ConsideringEmmeline
Sorry, you will have to stay confused about Emmeline, because the experts are confused about it.
Emmeline was introduced into England by the Normans at the time of the Norman Conquest. Already back then a thousand years ago, it was unclear whether it was derived from Amelia or from Emma.
Amelia is where the "work" or "industrious" derivations come from.
Most experts today believe that Emma goes back to a word which meant "whole" or "universal".
And a bit later in history, after Emily was introduced into English speaking countries, some parents used Emmeline as an expansion of that name. Emily is ultimately from a Latin name which probably meant "rival."
I don't know where the "peaceful home" idea came from. That one seems to be incorrect.
Emmeline was introduced into England by the Normans at the time of the Norman Conquest. Already back then a thousand years ago, it was unclear whether it was derived from Amelia or from Emma.
Amelia is where the "work" or "industrious" derivations come from.
Most experts today believe that Emma goes back to a word which meant "whole" or "universal".
And a bit later in history, after Emily was introduced into English speaking countries, some parents used Emmeline as an expansion of that name. Emily is ultimately from a Latin name which probably meant "rival."
I don't know where the "peaceful home" idea came from. That one seems to be incorrect.
This message was edited 3/18/2009, 7:55 PM
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Replies
I'm German and...
"heim" pronounce HYME means "home" in German. "linde" is the German word for a tree (I think it's called Linden Tree or something in English).
"peaceful" means "friedlich" in German. So I have no idea where they got this from. Emmeline definitely does NOT mean "peaceful home" in German. "heim" doesn't even appear in the name Emmeline (except for when you pronounce it to rhyme with "wine" then it rhymes as in "line", "hyme").
The source would be one of those baby name sites who try to make a name more attractive by changing the meaning a bit. I wouldn't trust these sites.
Emmeline would be a form of Emma or Amelia (doesn't matter as they come from the same source anyway). I think the Emma theory is very likely to be true.
I think the chances that it means "peaceful home" are very slim.
"heim" pronounce HYME means "home" in German. "linde" is the German word for a tree (I think it's called Linden Tree or something in English).
"peaceful" means "friedlich" in German. So I have no idea where they got this from. Emmeline definitely does NOT mean "peaceful home" in German. "heim" doesn't even appear in the name Emmeline (except for when you pronounce it to rhyme with "wine" then it rhymes as in "line", "hyme").
The source would be one of those baby name sites who try to make a name more attractive by changing the meaning a bit. I wouldn't trust these sites.
Emmeline would be a form of Emma or Amelia (doesn't matter as they come from the same source anyway). I think the Emma theory is very likely to be true.
I think the chances that it means "peaceful home" are very slim.
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linde, maybe? Meaning "gentle, tender"?
They sure are stretching.
They sure are stretching.
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Probably they are thinking in lind(e), originally meaning "lime tree" and by extension "flexible, smooth, soft, tender" (later, it meant also "shield" because the shields were often made of lime tree wood). I can understand that somebody interprets "gentle" as extension of "tender", interpreted in a figurate sense or as a personal virtue and not in the actual material sense, but "peace" or "peaceful"? This interpretation goes far away from what I can imagine.
This message was edited 3/20/2009, 2:46 PM
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"peaceful"
Connectiong the "peaceful" interpretation that aren't related to etymology,I can hazard two guesses.
First, Lime in Europe refers to the Tilia family of trees, otherwise known as Lindens (and Basswood in North America). The flowers and fruit of Linden trees contain a medicinal compound that calms and soothes and has a pleasant taste and odor. The flower has a similiar smell to citrus lime flower but they are unrelated plants.
In European history, lime trees were often symbols of love and peace. Probably because they were so common, smelled good, and provided an excellent source of nectar for honey bees. There's a famous street in Germany that is lined with lindens---in Berlin I think, but I'm not up to research right now.
Connectiong the "peaceful" interpretation that aren't related to etymology,I can hazard two guesses.
First, Lime in Europe refers to the Tilia family of trees, otherwise known as Lindens (and Basswood in North America). The flowers and fruit of Linden trees contain a medicinal compound that calms and soothes and has a pleasant taste and odor. The flower has a similiar smell to citrus lime flower but they are unrelated plants.
In European history, lime trees were often symbols of love and peace. Probably because they were so common, smelled good, and provided an excellent source of nectar for honey bees. There's a famous street in Germany that is lined with lindens---in Berlin I think, but I'm not up to research right now.
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Yes, probably someone has taken a symbolism or association related to the tree and has applied that to the Old German element because the notion of "peace" is very attractive as meaning and some names websites and books seem to embellish, or just made up, the meanings.
It would be, in that case, another example of confusion between meaning (etymology) and association (history), which I have found several times with Tania, for instance, explained as "fairy queen".
It would be, in that case, another example of confusion between meaning (etymology) and association (history), which I have found several times with Tania, for instance, explained as "fairy queen".
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If they're looking at it like that, that's some serious extrapolation (on Babynamer's part, not yours). The Emma/Irmen and Amalia connections are so much simpler.
If it works, though, that's great for ConsideringEmmeline. I know what it's like to want a name with several potential meanings to be one in particular, and more concrete.
This is interesting. Thanks. =)
If it works, though, that's great for ConsideringEmmeline. I know what it's like to want a name with several potential meanings to be one in particular, and more concrete.
This is interesting. Thanks. =)
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Oh wow! That is so helpful! :)
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tender home?
So is this possible? lol
:)
So is this possible? lol
:)
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Yes, very confusing.
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