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ArchivesRe: Rules about female/male names in different countries
in reply to a message by Ylva
Name laws are very strict in Germany, you don't have the right to invent names as in the US f.ex. (But of course, once some invented name has been used in the US or elsewhere in the world, you have the right to use it as well... makes sense doesn't it ... )
Likewise it has to be clear through the name alone whether the person is female or male. There are a few unisex names that have established themselves, mostly imported (a lot from France for example) - in that case you have to chose a second name which makes the gender clear.
It also depends a lot on the person of the state which fills out the birth certificate. Some of them will refuse "Kim" as a male name and others will allow it.
"Andrea" is another problem case, in Germany it is strictly female, but in Swiss or Italian it is male, therefore in Switzerland at least, you always had to use a second name.
I hope this explanation is clear :) I think the laws in Germany are too strict. But then in the US they aren't strict enough ;)
Likewise it has to be clear through the name alone whether the person is female or male. There are a few unisex names that have established themselves, mostly imported (a lot from France for example) - in that case you have to chose a second name which makes the gender clear.
It also depends a lot on the person of the state which fills out the birth certificate. Some of them will refuse "Kim" as a male name and others will allow it.
"Andrea" is another problem case, in Germany it is strictly female, but in Swiss or Italian it is male, therefore in Switzerland at least, you always had to use a second name.
I hope this explanation is clear :) I think the laws in Germany are too strict. But then in the US they aren't strict enough ;)
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Replies
Good laws I think
I don't think the children will suffer b/c they get gender-specific names.
Though as Swedish I of course see Kim as more male than female, since it is traditionally short for Joakim.
I can imagine that the laws can't stop American parents living in Germany, since they can show that Taylor, Madison, Alexis (a male Greek name), Morgan, Riley, Jordan, McKenzie, Kennedy, Addison, Paris, Jamie, Reese, Harley, Casey, Robin, Logan, Ryan, Dylan, Ashton, Sydney, Christian, Nikita (a male Russian name) etc, b/c these are (sometimes exclusively) used for girls in USA.
I don't think the children will suffer b/c they get gender-specific names.
Though as Swedish I of course see Kim as more male than female, since it is traditionally short for Joakim.
I can imagine that the laws can't stop American parents living in Germany, since they can show that Taylor, Madison, Alexis (a male Greek name), Morgan, Riley, Jordan, McKenzie, Kennedy, Addison, Paris, Jamie, Reese, Harley, Casey, Robin, Logan, Ryan, Dylan, Ashton, Sydney, Christian, Nikita (a male Russian name) etc, b/c these are (sometimes exclusively) used for girls in USA.
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I think they're more likely to suffer if they get gender-neutral names ... and I was puzzled when Kim became popular for girls, partly because of the boy in Kipling and partly because it seemed to be short for Kimberley, which is a place name here in South Africa. This was before the Great Place Name Explosion!
Some years ago I met some people from Kiel who had their first child in Freiburg and had to argue at some length, they said, to persuade the registrar that the North German name they'd chosen really did exist. Can't recall now what it was - should have written it down; it wasn't a name I knew either. This wasn't a case of gender confusion; just a name the registrar hadn't heard of, didn't like the look of, and assumed was an invention. Luckily, the proud father was a professor of linguistics and could prove his point.
Some years ago I met some people from Kiel who had their first child in Freiburg and had to argue at some length, they said, to persuade the registrar that the North German name they'd chosen really did exist. Can't recall now what it was - should have written it down; it wasn't a name I knew either. This wasn't a case of gender confusion; just a name the registrar hadn't heard of, didn't like the look of, and assumed was an invention. Luckily, the proud father was a professor of linguistics and could prove his point.
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Switzerland has more or less the same strict name laws as Germany, and if you want to use a name that does not tell the gender you have to use a second name that does.
However, being born and living in the German-speaking part of Switzerland, I never heard of Andrea in particular as being such a problem case. In German Andrea is clearly female, and people from the German-speaking part don't have a problem with its gender.
It might be otherwise in the Italian-speaking part of Switzerland however; I just don't know about the situation there.
However, being born and living in the German-speaking part of Switzerland, I never heard of Andrea in particular as being such a problem case. In German Andrea is clearly female, and people from the German-speaking part don't have a problem with its gender.
It might be otherwise in the Italian-speaking part of Switzerland however; I just don't know about the situation there.
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