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HelpRe: Primrose
in reply to a message by Lily
Prim rose. PRIM ROWS. For godsake, "prim rows." Primrose of What? Teeth? Tulips?
If the prim part suggested its etymology better (first), it might work. But it doesn't. This rose is prim, and primness is small and thwarts things.
I still love to hate it! Thanks for another chance! I'm shouting out with glee!
What I said back in March before seeing/reading Hunger Games:
... Primrose is too cutesy for me. I think it sounds twee and stuckup.
Prim is annoying. Rosie is fine. Rose is better.
I think Primula (genus name of the flower) or Primarosa would be nicer by about a factor of ten.
I think the second worst thing about Primrose (after the word prim in it and the sound of "prim rows") is the sound, the feeling of saying it - the "pr" plus "mr" is so ... pursed-lippy. Like a word a boudoir photographer would tell the subject to say, to get a big fat pout in the picture. Primrose. Mwah!
.... is still how I feel. Only now, I feel even more negatively about it, because of the images in the book and film. The character is completely angelic - it's like she is already dead! - and exists for the sole purpose of buffing and masculinizing the protagonist's role. The name makes a gross cliche even grosser. Not that I didn't think the book was yummy in its way, but naming a real person Primrose is ... uh. I'm sorry. I really think it is not namey enough, not even close. I would HATE to be named Primrose (mwah).
I'm sure a few people will get infatuated with it and name their babies it, and there are worse names. Whatever. I can accept that but I don't have to like it.
If the prim part suggested its etymology better (first), it might work. But it doesn't. This rose is prim, and primness is small and thwarts things.
I still love to hate it! Thanks for another chance! I'm shouting out with glee!
What I said back in March before seeing/reading Hunger Games:
... Primrose is too cutesy for me. I think it sounds twee and stuckup.
Prim is annoying. Rosie is fine. Rose is better.
I think Primula (genus name of the flower) or Primarosa would be nicer by about a factor of ten.
I think the second worst thing about Primrose (after the word prim in it and the sound of "prim rows") is the sound, the feeling of saying it - the "pr" plus "mr" is so ... pursed-lippy. Like a word a boudoir photographer would tell the subject to say, to get a big fat pout in the picture. Primrose. Mwah!
.... is still how I feel. Only now, I feel even more negatively about it, because of the images in the book and film. The character is completely angelic - it's like she is already dead! - and exists for the sole purpose of buffing and masculinizing the protagonist's role. The name makes a gross cliche even grosser. Not that I didn't think the book was yummy in its way, but naming a real person Primrose is ... uh. I'm sorry. I really think it is not namey enough, not even close. I would HATE to be named Primrose (mwah).
I'm sure a few people will get infatuated with it and name their babies it, and there are worse names. Whatever. I can accept that but I don't have to like it.
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Replies
Completely agree. I think it's the "prim" that really makes the "rose" part unbearable. How much more faux-angelic are you trying to get?
It's ridiculous and sounds snobbish with a side of bleh.
It's ridiculous and sounds snobbish with a side of bleh.
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I love to hate it, too. It's just so much fun to rip this name apart.
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But it's so easy...
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Hey, there is no shame in enjoying something that is easy.
It can't be TOO easy, anyway, because Lily does like it.
It can't be TOO easy, anyway, because Lily does like it.
This message was edited 11/17/2012, 10:18 AM
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...maybe it's fun because it's easy?
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and after all...
It is only a name. Why should it be hard to like or dislike a name?
It always makes me roll my eyes when I see a post that goes like "I want so much to like the name Victoria! But I just can't! Please help convince me!"
Why is it so important to like a name? Just because it's a classic/Biblical/uncommon? Why not just admit you don't like it and move on to the next? Why beg people over the internet to change your opinion?
It is only a name. Why should it be hard to like or dislike a name?
It always makes me roll my eyes when I see a post that goes like "I want so much to like the name Victoria! But I just can't! Please help convince me!"
Why is it so important to like a name? Just because it's a classic/Biblical/uncommon? Why not just admit you don't like it and move on to the next? Why beg people over the internet to change your opinion?
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I might be repeating myself but ... explaining myself because I did this recently ...
When I did this for Alice it wasn't because I wanted to like it. I still don't like it. I just wanted to be able to understand what its appeal is, because for almost every other name that is popular, I "get" why people like it even when I don't like it. Not "getting it" makes me feel like I'm out of touch, with the Zeitgeist or something ... I don't need to feel cool anymore, but I like to understand what IS considered cool, just because I feel like I have a distorted perspective otherwise. Now, I sort of get how people who like Alice, see Alice.
When I did this for Alice it wasn't because I wanted to like it. I still don't like it. I just wanted to be able to understand what its appeal is, because for almost every other name that is popular, I "get" why people like it even when I don't like it. Not "getting it" makes me feel like I'm out of touch, with the Zeitgeist or something ... I don't need to feel cool anymore, but I like to understand what IS considered cool, just because I feel like I have a distorted perspective otherwise. Now, I sort of get how people who like Alice, see Alice.
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Well, for one thing, maybe someone wants to like a name for a reason you don't understand, which should be ok with you, but whatever. The Primrose thing is just that it's the same very easy argument. Let's take a survey of the various complaints.
"frilly and cutesy"
"frilly and prissy"
"Hunger games"
"horrible name to give to a little girl" negative little girl stereotypes: Quiet, Proper, Delicate, Weak, Feeble, Innocent, wisp of a person; Hunger games
"embodies the stereotype of what girls were expected to be"; stupid
"very twee"
"just sounds too prissy"
"prim rows" "twee and stuckup" "pursed-lippy" feeling; Hunger games; "makes a gross cliche even grosser" "not namey enough"
Primness not a good trait; a perpetuation of prissy and proper femininity; a 19th century feminine caricature, cursed to unending propriety
Primness not good; Primrose Shipman
"too delicate" "meek, helpless" "girl who never raises her voice and does anything interesting" "sickeningly sweet" "too old fashioned"
"sickly sweet" "hunger games" animal name or gross immature hunger games fangirl name; Primrose Shipman
Hunger Games "prim and proper" "stuck up and untarnished"
Like... this is very obvious. Simpletons can see that this name offers up a cliche image of weakness and politeness, that it's very corny. It was used in the hunger games, which most people know now. It is very simple to make the connection between the "prim" in the first half of the name and the word "prim." How long has it been since someone had a new complaint about this name? No wonder Lily keeps asking for opinions. She can see the prim stereotype; she's looking for someone who sees something else about this name.
Is there anything else about this name?? Does it have any qualities aside from its tweeness? I couldn't find any. Mirfak pointed out the pursed-lip thing, which was interesting, but no one else has said anything not immediately obvious about it. What's the deal, Lily? Why are you so into this name?
"frilly and cutesy"
"frilly and prissy"
"Hunger games"
"horrible name to give to a little girl" negative little girl stereotypes: Quiet, Proper, Delicate, Weak, Feeble, Innocent, wisp of a person; Hunger games
"embodies the stereotype of what girls were expected to be"; stupid
"very twee"
"just sounds too prissy"
"prim rows" "twee and stuckup" "pursed-lippy" feeling; Hunger games; "makes a gross cliche even grosser" "not namey enough"
Primness not a good trait; a perpetuation of prissy and proper femininity; a 19th century feminine caricature, cursed to unending propriety
Primness not good; Primrose Shipman
"too delicate" "meek, helpless" "girl who never raises her voice and does anything interesting" "sickeningly sweet" "too old fashioned"
"sickly sweet" "hunger games" animal name or gross immature hunger games fangirl name; Primrose Shipman
Hunger Games "prim and proper" "stuck up and untarnished"
Like... this is very obvious. Simpletons can see that this name offers up a cliche image of weakness and politeness, that it's very corny. It was used in the hunger games, which most people know now. It is very simple to make the connection between the "prim" in the first half of the name and the word "prim." How long has it been since someone had a new complaint about this name? No wonder Lily keeps asking for opinions. She can see the prim stereotype; she's looking for someone who sees something else about this name.
Is there anything else about this name?? Does it have any qualities aside from its tweeness? I couldn't find any. Mirfak pointed out the pursed-lip thing, which was interesting, but no one else has said anything not immediately obvious about it. What's the deal, Lily? Why are you so into this name?
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Taking the challenge myself...
Of course Primrose has qualities aside from tweeness. It sounds tough-pretty. The primrose is a hardy perennial. The bright and delicate flowers bloom, on a compact and tidy plant, before it has stopped being freezing out, while everything else is still under the ground. The petals should wilt in the freeze but they don't. And like I said, primness is small and thwarts things - everyday discipline and determination are small and thwarting things too, but they are also good bits of character. The Primrose in HG is not useless, she's selfless and excellent. (She's also so innocent and vulnerable that it's barf-worthy.)
It's just that the PRIM ROWS sound and image overwhelm it, they can't be overlooked. IMHO. Very, very few people are going to hear the name Primrose and think "ah, hardy perennial, color in the snow, how splendid!"
Of course Primrose has qualities aside from tweeness. It sounds tough-pretty. The primrose is a hardy perennial. The bright and delicate flowers bloom, on a compact and tidy plant, before it has stopped being freezing out, while everything else is still under the ground. The petals should wilt in the freeze but they don't. And like I said, primness is small and thwarts things - everyday discipline and determination are small and thwarting things too, but they are also good bits of character. The Primrose in HG is not useless, she's selfless and excellent. (She's also so innocent and vulnerable that it's barf-worthy.)
It's just that the PRIM ROWS sound and image overwhelm it, they can't be overlooked. IMHO. Very, very few people are going to hear the name Primrose and think "ah, hardy perennial, color in the snow, how splendid!"
This message was edited 11/18/2012, 11:07 AM
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I think it's just one of those names that makes you want to punch something. People get their frustrations out with it, I guess. It's a "target" name.
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Ah, for me it is the opposite.
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I enjoy both. I like doing things that are more difficult, but I also like doing things that are easy. If I'm tired, I'll go with 'easy'.
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Yes - I love your conclusions about Prim in The Hunger Games. It just occurred to me that she's very like Beth from Little Women.
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Very well said
This is why I don't like the name OR the character.
No I don't think the Hunger Games makes it any more useable (the books & film are very flawed but enjoyable). I do think it would suit a cat, though.
This is why I don't like the name OR the character.
No I don't think the Hunger Games makes it any more useable (the books & film are very flawed but enjoyable). I do think it would suit a cat, though.
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Good point about the pursed lips.
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