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Help[Opinions] Sappho
I've posted this before but I'm looking for opinions once again.
I really, really like this name. A lot. I always have, I always will. I don't really care that it's associated with lesbians and what-not (whether or not that is justified is another argument). I love the poet, I love the name.
Could I get away with it, or would I be seen as a separatist weirdo? (That's a quote from a comment on the name.) What about as a middle name? It's just such a lovely name that deserves to be used.
I really, really like this name. A lot. I always have, I always will. I don't really care that it's associated with lesbians and what-not (whether or not that is justified is another argument). I love the poet, I love the name.
Could I get away with it, or would I be seen as a separatist weirdo? (That's a quote from a comment on the name.) What about as a middle name? It's just such a lovely name that deserves to be used.
This message was edited 4/25/2010, 5:35 PM
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"Separatist weirdo" wouldn't be my first choice when describing someone who would use this name, but using this name does bring a certain look-at-how-artsy-I-am association to my mind and that (but not you specifically so I mean no offense) really annoys me.
But I like the cat-name idea. I love giving cats weird names.
But I like the cat-name idea. I love giving cats weird names.
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I doubt the vast majority people will get the lesbian association with this name.
I like it! I think I'd make a neat middle name or a nickname (e.g. Sapphira).
I like it! I think I'd make a neat middle name or a nickname (e.g. Sapphira).
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I am grumpy today, so apologies in advance
I think that, strict aesthetic appeals aside, the name does unfortunately come with baggage. It all depends on how you feel about carrying that baggage. Are you ok with getting the occasional sidelong glance and knowing smiles? Are you ok with tirelessly explaining the significance of Sappho and possibly having to identify your own sexuality, whatever that may be? Are you ok with having your daughter experience these same things? There is no good or bad answer - some people hate the idea of having to constantly educate the public, while others love it. And of course, it's hard to say how the public-at-large would react to such a name. Maybe they won't care at all. Maybe they don't even know who Sappho was. So who cares what other people think? People are mysterious! Do what you want! Name anarchy!
I will say though that today it irks me to see all the "but LESBIANS" comments. Yeah, ok, Sappho came from Lesbia -edit: Lesbos, thank you- and that is where the word lesbians come from. But the question that remains is - what is WRONG with thinking about lesbians, or being reminded of the existence of lesbians when you see the name? If people really claim to be pro-gay-marriage, equal rights and whatnot, then what is wrong with the name because it "makes one think of lesbians"? I never hear "oh that name makes me think of straight people, so no, it's too much pressure on a kid/it's not fair to them/etc". It just reinforces the idea that being homosexual is "not normal". Why is it "cruel" to use a name that references lesbians but it's not cruel to make a child wear the expectation that she will be heterosexual?
Anyways, all THAT fun stuff aside, it is a lovely name. It's very hip. You are right, O-ending gives it a real edgy edge while still being melodic and beautiful. I also like Cleis, the name of Sappho's daughter (and mother).
I think that, strict aesthetic appeals aside, the name does unfortunately come with baggage. It all depends on how you feel about carrying that baggage. Are you ok with getting the occasional sidelong glance and knowing smiles? Are you ok with tirelessly explaining the significance of Sappho and possibly having to identify your own sexuality, whatever that may be? Are you ok with having your daughter experience these same things? There is no good or bad answer - some people hate the idea of having to constantly educate the public, while others love it. And of course, it's hard to say how the public-at-large would react to such a name. Maybe they won't care at all. Maybe they don't even know who Sappho was. So who cares what other people think? People are mysterious! Do what you want! Name anarchy!
I will say though that today it irks me to see all the "but LESBIANS" comments. Yeah, ok, Sappho came from Lesbia -edit: Lesbos, thank you- and that is where the word lesbians come from. But the question that remains is - what is WRONG with thinking about lesbians, or being reminded of the existence of lesbians when you see the name? If people really claim to be pro-gay-marriage, equal rights and whatnot, then what is wrong with the name because it "makes one think of lesbians"? I never hear "oh that name makes me think of straight people, so no, it's too much pressure on a kid/it's not fair to them/etc". It just reinforces the idea that being homosexual is "not normal". Why is it "cruel" to use a name that references lesbians but it's not cruel to make a child wear the expectation that she will be heterosexual?
Anyways, all THAT fun stuff aside, it is a lovely name. It's very hip. You are right, O-ending gives it a real edgy edge while still being melodic and beautiful. I also like Cleis, the name of Sappho's daughter (and mother).
This message was edited 4/26/2010, 11:38 AM
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Having spent 28 years explaining my own name
And spelling it, and telling the not-very-exciting story of how I got it (My mom babysat a little girl with the name and it became her favorite name) I'm hesitant to put my child through it.
Otherwise, I agree 100% with you. I hate the fact that it's "bad" that the name is related to lesb.ians - it's ridic to me. I just don't know if I can make my child go through it to prove a political and aesthetic point.
And spelling it, and telling the not-very-exciting story of how I got it (My mom babysat a little girl with the name and it became her favorite name) I'm hesitant to put my child through it.
Otherwise, I agree 100% with you. I hate the fact that it's "bad" that the name is related to lesb.ians - it's ridic to me. I just don't know if I can make my child go through it to prove a political and aesthetic point.
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Sappho came from the island of Lesbos not Lesbia.
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I don't think it's necessarily the reminder of homosexuality that's the issue, although of course it is for a lot of people probably. I think for a name to be a constant reminder of sex one way or another is rather unsavory. Like wearing a low cut shirt all the time. I mean I wouldn't name my kid Sexton.
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For me it's the association with sexuality that bothers me, if there were a name that sounded very close or meant "heterosexual" I'd find it just as off-putting. Just try making a google search for "sapphic" and see what happens. Talk about baggage. And Sappho also gives a few dodgy images, thought not as many as I thought, amongst all the pretty paintings of women in classical garb.
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I have several times said that one of the reasons I dislike the name Leslie is that it makes me think of the word "lesbian." That's not the only reason I dislike it, but it's one reason.
I don't even think that's true of the general public, I think it's just me, judging by the popularity of the name, and the fact that I have never heard anyone else make the same statement.
So after reading your post, I tried to analyze why a name reminding me of "lesbian" made me dislike it. Because of course I am pro-gay rights and pro-gay marriage and had a lesbian friend I really liked, etc.
Then I realized that every time a name makes me think of a word or thing, I don't like the name. Hannah makes me think of chicken soup. (Don't ask, I don't know why!) I hate Hannah. David makes me think of potatoes and gravy. I hate David. Claire always makes me think of eclairs. I don't really care for Claire, even though I like eclairs just fine. I just don't like thinking of a word or an object every time I hear a name. So Leslie\lesbian isn't singled out. But I think that lesbian is the only non-food thing that I have a name association with!
Anyway, I think a lot of people, even though they may have nothing whatsoever against homosexuality themselves, are just being practical and thinking of the world at large, and bowing to the reality that a lot of people still do disapprove of homosexuals and that will probably never change. It's all well and good to say in theory, "I won't let people's prejudices affect my name choice" but when you are really naming your child, whom you know will have to live with the name and its associations, and you realize that you are making a big decision that will affect your child's life much more than yours, it can be a different story.
I don't even think that's true of the general public, I think it's just me, judging by the popularity of the name, and the fact that I have never heard anyone else make the same statement.
So after reading your post, I tried to analyze why a name reminding me of "lesbian" made me dislike it. Because of course I am pro-gay rights and pro-gay marriage and had a lesbian friend I really liked, etc.
Then I realized that every time a name makes me think of a word or thing, I don't like the name. Hannah makes me think of chicken soup. (Don't ask, I don't know why!) I hate Hannah. David makes me think of potatoes and gravy. I hate David. Claire always makes me think of eclairs. I don't really care for Claire, even though I like eclairs just fine. I just don't like thinking of a word or an object every time I hear a name. So Leslie\lesbian isn't singled out. But I think that lesbian is the only non-food thing that I have a name association with!
Anyway, I think a lot of people, even though they may have nothing whatsoever against homosexuality themselves, are just being practical and thinking of the world at large, and bowing to the reality that a lot of people still do disapprove of homosexuals and that will probably never change. It's all well and good to say in theory, "I won't let people's prejudices affect my name choice" but when you are really naming your child, whom you know will have to live with the name and its associations, and you realize that you are making a big decision that will affect your child's life much more than yours, it can be a different story.
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It's a theoretically a good name with an awesome namesake, but I don't think it's usable, even as a mn because of the connotations of the expression "sapphic love." ETA: I find any name which has a sexual association inappropriate, whatever kind of sexuality it refer to.
This message was edited 4/26/2010, 4:42 AM
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I just asked a room of fourteen people -multiple intelligence levels, educational backgrounds, ages, and ethnicities and I'm the only one who knew who Sappho was. However, ma few knew what sapphism was.
So, I don't know how often people would know who the poet (poetess? Is that a real word?), but the association of sapphism might be a problem.
In theory, I like it. In practice, I don't know.
And I'm pansexual, so it's nothing on a homophobic front. It's just may not be something a young girl would want to deal with.
So, I don't know how often people would know who the poet (poetess? Is that a real word?), but the association of sapphism might be a problem.
In theory, I like it. In practice, I don't know.
And I'm pansexual, so it's nothing on a homophobic front. It's just may not be something a young girl would want to deal with.
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It is a pretty name but you have to know that other people will make fun of your daughter, no matter what you think about the name.
Saffron is an alternative. You could use the nn Saffi/Saphie.
Saffron is an alternative. You could use the nn Saffi/Saphie.
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I can see the appeal (I really quite like girls names ending in -o, there is something so spunky about them) but I agree with Eilis- I don't think your daughter will thank you for saddling her with a name that is pretty inextricably linked to lesbians. Its just an unnecessary challenge when there are plenty of other names out there. Sad though :-( It would be an awesome name for a cat.
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It would be cruel to give your child this name. And this comes from someone who is pro gay marriage, pro do whatever you want with your body, super crazy liberal. Lesbia is also a legit name and I wouldn't recommend that either.
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Regarding 'cruel' in homophobic sense: I guess this all depends upon the environment in which the child grew up. I didn't realise that some people thought badly of homosexuality until I was nine and didn't encounter it personally in childhood.
I'm against Sappho as a name because it belongs to the poet - I can't see it on anyone else's child without thinking of her. It would be like naming a daughter Oprah. A child's name should be her own.
Also it seems very 'look at me, I'm well read' and almost pompous.
I'm against Sappho as a name because it belongs to the poet - I can't see it on anyone else's child without thinking of her. It would be like naming a daughter Oprah. A child's name should be her own.
Also it seems very 'look at me, I'm well read' and almost pompous.
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Heck, Leslie makes me think of lesbians. Lesbia---oh, no.
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Lesbians
Even if you don't care, lots and lots of other people will. That will be a huge hurdle that your daughter would probably not thank you for.
In and of itself I don't know if I like it or not. The O ending on a female name is interesting and uncommon and appeals to me. The downside of that is that with the S and ph plus the long O I can't shake Sophie when I see it. I'm sick to death of Sophie. :-/ So it is a definite strike against it.
I'm not a huge fan, either, of names that to me "belong" to one particular person. Sappho is just Sappho, not someone else's kid. Kind of like how Che Guevara is Che. The name is so "him" to me that it isn't up for grabs.
In real life, I would give it a thumbs down. As far as names go without context to me it's not bad but not particularly compelling.
Even if you don't care, lots and lots of other people will. That will be a huge hurdle that your daughter would probably not thank you for.
In and of itself I don't know if I like it or not. The O ending on a female name is interesting and uncommon and appeals to me. The downside of that is that with the S and ph plus the long O I can't shake Sophie when I see it. I'm sick to death of Sophie. :-/ So it is a definite strike against it.
I'm not a huge fan, either, of names that to me "belong" to one particular person. Sappho is just Sappho, not someone else's kid. Kind of like how Che Guevara is Che. The name is so "him" to me that it isn't up for grabs.
In real life, I would give it a thumbs down. As far as names go without context to me it's not bad but not particularly compelling.
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I know a girl named Cielo. :)
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That might be a good idea. :-)
You know as well as anyone how difficult an unusual name can be. Imagine an unusual name with such strong connotations. :-/
Great cat name, though, if you really do want to use it!
You know as well as anyone how difficult an unusual name can be. Imagine an unusual name with such strong connotations. :-/
Great cat name, though, if you really do want to use it!
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