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Help[Opinions] Re: Ilya, and some other Russian names
in reply to a message by Tippins
Sorry I couldn't answer your post about Finnish names! It was very interesting, and I had alrewady ideas, what to write. I think I'll PM you tomorrow morning before going out.
You had good luck with the Russian speakers - both Ilya and Andrey are on my PNL, and Tatiana is another name I adore. They're all, including Olga, pretty random (actually there are only about fifty Russian names for both genders that are used on 90% of people. "Russian" names, like Aglaia, Nikandr, Akulina, Panteleimon or Praskovya aren't actually used like at all, though in the last ten years there is a nationalistic trend of using very rare folk-related names, like Vasilisa, Dobrynya, Yegor, Gleb, Uliana and so on.)
Think Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky, Vladimir Ilyich Lenin. It is not a girl name actually.
- Ilyich is in both cases the patronymic name. You may know that, but I've seen too often people thinking that Ilyich is an actual name.
The pet form is Ilyusha but he did not use it and I only used it twice.
- Your Ilya came from "a good family". Ilyusha is the more... um, not upperclassish, but... Oh, just take a look at this wiki-article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligentsia - I mean that people who are related to this "social class" use Ilyusha, but the slang/lowerclass form you see more often is Ilyukha. The same thing with Aleksei - Lyosha is the "educated" form, Lyokha the form you hear on the streets.
I love Ilya very much because of the associations I have with it and the soft sound. My friend's (Fyedya - or Fyodor Vladimirovich.) elder brother is Ilya, my mom's best friend's dad, who was a good friend of my grannddad was Ilya Gesselevich, a nice scientist who stays often at us is Ilya and a great ballet teacher I happen to know is Ilya.
His middle name is Felixovich
- Patronymic name, you mean? His dad was a Felix. A friend of mine, Kirill, is also officially Kirill Feliksovich. And a famous ballerina, Matilda Kshesinskaya, was Feliksovna.
Mikhail I don't like that much but I love Misha
- Mikhail is on my PNL. It has great associations, too. (Actually for every Russian you can find some nice association because of tons of bearers)
Maria I love Mashka for
- Masha is the more regal form. Mashka is a little more familiar. My mom calls me Mashka when she wants something (like cleaing the floor) from me. But yeah, I love Masha - just think of all the characters by Chekhov named Masha!
Gavril I think is my favorite, and I love the nickname Ganya
- This is from idiot, rigth? Originally Gavril is Gavrila Ardalionovich (Ardalion is anothr name you don't see today). I have never gotten, why does Dostoyevsky all him Ganya, but f. ex. Aleksandra is never Sasha...
Dmitry I love, and Mitya and Dima
- Mitya, please! Dima is horribly trendy, but right now Mitya is considered very old-fashioned. I love it because of my ex-classmate (aka D1) and because in one of my favourite films (Nine days in one year http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0054803/) the "main" character is Mitya Gusev played by Aleksei Batalov. Just look at him! http://www.portal-slovo.ru/images/3397_11.jpg But I like Dima, too - my other ex-classmate, the one who was Dima (aka D2) was very clever, unbelievably good at chess and maths and had a great sense of humour. My first crush. :D Btw, whe he lived in Russia, in his class were either five or four Dmitrys (I don't remember).
Aleksandr nn Sasha
- Ha, I call Sander sometimes Sasha! I've also tried Shurik (see Shura), but he didn't like it. Weird, but I never call him Alex. Aleksandr is a lovely name - my granddad is Aleksandr Lazarevich, btw. There isn't anything special in it, Aleksandr is one of the most random names in the world. Much worse than John or David.
Alexei is growing on me, will someone sell me on it?
- I can try! (On my PNL spelled the Czech way) Take a look at Aleksei Batalov! :D Ok, Lyuosha or Alyosha are both very sweet and soft nicknames. Aleksei Konstantinovich Tolstoi (not Lev) is a good writer with a good sense humour. Though I don't like him that much after reading "the Vampire" - it was too scary for me. (I was 11, but the traumas are alive)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleksey_Konstantinovich_Tolstoy
http://www.poems.md/aleksey-konstantinovich-tolstoy/don-juans-serenade-1798.html
If you like ice skating, there's Aleksei Yagudin. And well, Aleksei has such a shy, friendly feeling in it - funny, when you think about the meaning. Every Aleksei I have known (this is funny but both Mitya's and Dima's fathers are named Aleksei) has been more or less intuitive, good at school and charming. A little quiet sometimes. I also think that Aleksei is much more modest, simple, peaceful and "smiling" than, let's say Aleksandr. Oh well, I'm not good at selling names. :) Aleksei is like wine, you need some time to start liking it.
Anastasia
- Anastasia is definitely not exotic! http://www.behindthename.com/bb/arcview.php?id=3252458&board=baby
Lev
- On my PNL :) Lyova is a sweet nickname!
Ivan and Vanya
- Thinking of adding it to my PNL. My dear friend is named Ivan, but he doesn't like it when people call hime Vanya, because it is "too childish". I don't agree, and my other aquaitance named Ivan says it is a pleasure to be Vanya, though he is irritated by its trendiness. (Belongs to the folk name-trend. Russian Ivan is a little like British Jack) And Vanyechka sounds very sweet! Do not forget "Uncle Vanya"!
Modest
- Was some time on my PNL. I don't know anyone named that. Tchaikovsky's brother was Modest and there's Modya Mussorgsky.
Yaromir
- Never heard in real life. Pretty and very rare. Yaroslav is much more popular.
Agafya
- Lol lol lol lol! In Russia there's a cheap and trendy soap/shampoo mark named "Recepies of granmother Agafya". http://www.nirgos.com/setuza/agafia.jpg
But meeting a real Agafya is as possible as meeting a bloke named Herbert-Bartholomew.
A couple random ones like Afanasiy
- Hate Afanasy. Maybe because I really dislike Ivan Bunin, who was Afanasyevich. And, though "The Master and Margarita", "Days of the Turbins" and "A Heart of a Dog" are all great works I read again and again, I have no personal symphaty for Mikhail Afanasyevich Bulgakov. :P
I don't want to list all the Russian names I like - they're basic to me that it would be actually the same as "list all your favourite English names. Tell me, how do you feel about English names" for you. :D
You had good luck with the Russian speakers - both Ilya and Andrey are on my PNL, and Tatiana is another name I adore. They're all, including Olga, pretty random (actually there are only about fifty Russian names for both genders that are used on 90% of people. "Russian" names, like Aglaia, Nikandr, Akulina, Panteleimon or Praskovya aren't actually used like at all, though in the last ten years there is a nationalistic trend of using very rare folk-related names, like Vasilisa, Dobrynya, Yegor, Gleb, Uliana and so on.)
Think Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky, Vladimir Ilyich Lenin. It is not a girl name actually.
- Ilyich is in both cases the patronymic name. You may know that, but I've seen too often people thinking that Ilyich is an actual name.
The pet form is Ilyusha but he did not use it and I only used it twice.
- Your Ilya came from "a good family". Ilyusha is the more... um, not upperclassish, but... Oh, just take a look at this wiki-article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligentsia - I mean that people who are related to this "social class" use Ilyusha, but the slang/lowerclass form you see more often is Ilyukha. The same thing with Aleksei - Lyosha is the "educated" form, Lyokha the form you hear on the streets.
I love Ilya very much because of the associations I have with it and the soft sound. My friend's (Fyedya - or Fyodor Vladimirovich.) elder brother is Ilya, my mom's best friend's dad, who was a good friend of my grannddad was Ilya Gesselevich, a nice scientist who stays often at us is Ilya and a great ballet teacher I happen to know is Ilya.
His middle name is Felixovich
- Patronymic name, you mean? His dad was a Felix. A friend of mine, Kirill, is also officially Kirill Feliksovich. And a famous ballerina, Matilda Kshesinskaya, was Feliksovna.
Mikhail I don't like that much but I love Misha
- Mikhail is on my PNL. It has great associations, too. (Actually for every Russian you can find some nice association because of tons of bearers)
Maria I love Mashka for
- Masha is the more regal form. Mashka is a little more familiar. My mom calls me Mashka when she wants something (like cleaing the floor) from me. But yeah, I love Masha - just think of all the characters by Chekhov named Masha!
Gavril I think is my favorite, and I love the nickname Ganya
- This is from idiot, rigth? Originally Gavril is Gavrila Ardalionovich (Ardalion is anothr name you don't see today). I have never gotten, why does Dostoyevsky all him Ganya, but f. ex. Aleksandra is never Sasha...
Dmitry I love, and Mitya and Dima
- Mitya, please! Dima is horribly trendy, but right now Mitya is considered very old-fashioned. I love it because of my ex-classmate (aka D1) and because in one of my favourite films (Nine days in one year http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0054803/) the "main" character is Mitya Gusev played by Aleksei Batalov. Just look at him! http://www.portal-slovo.ru/images/3397_11.jpg But I like Dima, too - my other ex-classmate, the one who was Dima (aka D2) was very clever, unbelievably good at chess and maths and had a great sense of humour. My first crush. :D Btw, whe he lived in Russia, in his class were either five or four Dmitrys (I don't remember).
Aleksandr nn Sasha
- Ha, I call Sander sometimes Sasha! I've also tried Shurik (see Shura), but he didn't like it. Weird, but I never call him Alex. Aleksandr is a lovely name - my granddad is Aleksandr Lazarevich, btw. There isn't anything special in it, Aleksandr is one of the most random names in the world. Much worse than John or David.
Alexei is growing on me, will someone sell me on it?
- I can try! (On my PNL spelled the Czech way) Take a look at Aleksei Batalov! :D Ok, Lyuosha or Alyosha are both very sweet and soft nicknames. Aleksei Konstantinovich Tolstoi (not Lev) is a good writer with a good sense humour. Though I don't like him that much after reading "the Vampire" - it was too scary for me. (I was 11, but the traumas are alive)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleksey_Konstantinovich_Tolstoy
http://www.poems.md/aleksey-konstantinovich-tolstoy/don-juans-serenade-1798.html
If you like ice skating, there's Aleksei Yagudin. And well, Aleksei has such a shy, friendly feeling in it - funny, when you think about the meaning. Every Aleksei I have known (this is funny but both Mitya's and Dima's fathers are named Aleksei) has been more or less intuitive, good at school and charming. A little quiet sometimes. I also think that Aleksei is much more modest, simple, peaceful and "smiling" than, let's say Aleksandr. Oh well, I'm not good at selling names. :) Aleksei is like wine, you need some time to start liking it.
Anastasia
- Anastasia is definitely not exotic! http://www.behindthename.com/bb/arcview.php?id=3252458&board=baby
Lev
- On my PNL :) Lyova is a sweet nickname!
Ivan and Vanya
- Thinking of adding it to my PNL. My dear friend is named Ivan, but he doesn't like it when people call hime Vanya, because it is "too childish". I don't agree, and my other aquaitance named Ivan says it is a pleasure to be Vanya, though he is irritated by its trendiness. (Belongs to the folk name-trend. Russian Ivan is a little like British Jack) And Vanyechka sounds very sweet! Do not forget "Uncle Vanya"!
Modest
- Was some time on my PNL. I don't know anyone named that. Tchaikovsky's brother was Modest and there's Modya Mussorgsky.
Yaromir
- Never heard in real life. Pretty and very rare. Yaroslav is much more popular.
Agafya
- Lol lol lol lol! In Russia there's a cheap and trendy soap/shampoo mark named "Recepies of granmother Agafya". http://www.nirgos.com/setuza/agafia.jpg
But meeting a real Agafya is as possible as meeting a bloke named Herbert-Bartholomew.
A couple random ones like Afanasiy
- Hate Afanasy. Maybe because I really dislike Ivan Bunin, who was Afanasyevich. And, though "The Master and Margarita", "Days of the Turbins" and "A Heart of a Dog" are all great works I read again and again, I have no personal symphaty for Mikhail Afanasyevich Bulgakov. :P
I don't want to list all the Russian names I like - they're basic to me that it would be actually the same as "list all your favourite English names. Tell me, how do you feel about English names" for you. :D
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Replies
Yeah I actually like all of their names pretty well.
Odd that they are random. Ilya is Ukranian, and I think that Olga and Tatiana are as well. That might have something to do with it?
LOL yeah I was telling my friend Janine about Ilya and she said "What's his full name" and I said "Ilya" and she said "That is a nickname" and I said "No it is the Russian form of Elijah think Tchaik and Lenin" and she said "Oh. I thought it was a nickname for that" and I said "BAHAHHAHA NO FOOL, ILYICH IS THE PATRONYMIC BAHAHAHAHHAHA" and she said "Ha ha ha."
That is interesting about the intelligentsia using Ilyusha. Ilya's family actually came to America when he was nine because "it just sucked" and "there weren't many prospects." Now they make concrete factories or something and are - fairly well off? I know Ilya went to Yale. Of course he is Ukrainian. And when I asked if there was a nickname for Ilya when I was grilling him about his name, he said "The diminutive is Ilyusha." So I dunno if his family uses it or what.
Ilyukha and Alyokha are fun too. Wow names are fun when they are not Hayden and Jace.
His midd- well. The conversation went thus. His English was perfect so I was surprised to find out he was, like, 4real Russian (did not yet know he was Ukranian).
Me: "Do you have a patronymic middle name too?"
Him: "Of course!"
Me: "OO WHAT IS IT"
Him: "Felixovich." (Probably it was Feliksovich. Whatev. I like x's.)
Me: "AWESOME I am def telling all of my namenerd friends about you"
Other people in the car: "Oh what does that mean"
Him: "In most eastern european countries it is traditional to use the father's first name with the suffix -ovich, which means 'son of,' as the son's middle name. So my father is Felix (Feliks), and my middle name is Feliksovich."
Odd that they are random. Ilya is Ukranian, and I think that Olga and Tatiana are as well. That might have something to do with it?
LOL yeah I was telling my friend Janine about Ilya and she said "What's his full name" and I said "Ilya" and she said "That is a nickname" and I said "No it is the Russian form of Elijah think Tchaik and Lenin" and she said "Oh. I thought it was a nickname for that" and I said "BAHAHHAHA NO FOOL, ILYICH IS THE PATRONYMIC BAHAHAHAHHAHA" and she said "Ha ha ha."
That is interesting about the intelligentsia using Ilyusha. Ilya's family actually came to America when he was nine because "it just sucked" and "there weren't many prospects." Now they make concrete factories or something and are - fairly well off? I know Ilya went to Yale. Of course he is Ukrainian. And when I asked if there was a nickname for Ilya when I was grilling him about his name, he said "The diminutive is Ilyusha." So I dunno if his family uses it or what.
Ilyukha and Alyokha are fun too. Wow names are fun when they are not Hayden and Jace.
His midd- well. The conversation went thus. His English was perfect so I was surprised to find out he was, like, 4real Russian (did not yet know he was Ukranian).
Me: "Do you have a patronymic middle name too?"
Him: "Of course!"
Me: "OO WHAT IS IT"
Him: "Felixovich." (Probably it was Feliksovich. Whatev. I like x's.)
Me: "AWESOME I am def telling all of my namenerd friends about you"
Other people in the car: "Oh what does that mean"
Him: "In most eastern european countries it is traditional to use the father's first name with the suffix -ovich, which means 'son of,' as the son's middle name. So my father is Felix (Feliks), and my middle name is Feliksovich."
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Oh well, Ukraine is still very related to Russia – you can live there easily without knowing Ukrainian like at all, so all the names Ukrainians use tend to be Russian. One little exception seems to be Oksana – all the Oksanas I’ve known have been originally from Ukraine. :P
I didn’t actually mean that only intelligentsia is using Ilyusha. Ilyukha sounds very street-related compared to Ilyusha, if you know, what I mean. It is like using “bad” words – you will never call yourself Alyokha among grandparents as well as you will never use vulgar words. Of course Ilyusha and Alyosha (Andriusha – Andryukha, Vanyusha – Vanyukha, Markusha - Markukha) are also the “official” nicknames. :) My mom, who is very proud of her belonging to “intelligentsia” would never call anyone of her friends Ilyukha.
Btw, I just thought I could add about nickname usage something. Actually there are two categories of name-nickname relationships.
1) Names like Andrei, Ilya, Yeva, Mark, Zhanna, Nikita, Oleg, Yan, Vera, Igor, Zoya. When people with those names introduce themselves, they never say: “I’m Olyezhka” or “I’m Verochka”. Those pet forms are too familiar and they aren’t used as often as nicknames for the names of the second cathegory.
2) Aleksandr, Yevgeny, Olga, Yelena, Yelizaveta, Mikhail, Anna, Grigory, Yuri, Darya, Maria, Konstantin, Anastasia, Stanislav.
I didn’t actually mean that only intelligentsia is using Ilyusha. Ilyukha sounds very street-related compared to Ilyusha, if you know, what I mean. It is like using “bad” words – you will never call yourself Alyokha among grandparents as well as you will never use vulgar words. Of course Ilyusha and Alyosha (Andriusha – Andryukha, Vanyusha – Vanyukha, Markusha - Markukha) are also the “official” nicknames. :) My mom, who is very proud of her belonging to “intelligentsia” would never call anyone of her friends Ilyukha.
Btw, I just thought I could add about nickname usage something. Actually there are two categories of name-nickname relationships.
1) Names like Andrei, Ilya, Yeva, Mark, Zhanna, Nikita, Oleg, Yan, Vera, Igor, Zoya. When people with those names introduce themselves, they never say: “I’m Olyezhka” or “I’m Verochka”. Those pet forms are too familiar and they aren’t used as often as nicknames for the names of the second cathegory.
2) Aleksandr, Yevgeny, Olga, Yelena, Yelizaveta, Mikhail, Anna, Grigory, Yuri, Darya, Maria, Konstantin, Anastasia, Stanislav.
This message was edited 6/19/2008, 11:28 AM
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