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Help[Facts] Mathonwy
Does anyone know what does "Mathonwy" means? I do know that "Math ap" is something like "Coin/treasure/money son of" where the following part is "Mathonwy" another name for his father according to one of the versions regarding this celtic character's parentage... I guess it would be something like "--- coin/treasure/money ---" but I fail to find the meaning of "onwy"... Any help will be apreciated.
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Several sources list the meaning of Math as Bear http://www.namenerds.com/welsh/trad2.html While the word Onwy seems unknown or up for conjecture, there is a river in Shropshire called Onwy and a river called Conwy. It seems in all the links to words woth onwy in them, they are related to water or possibly holy. It seems Celtic in origin rather than Gaelic which is also a matter of debate. So, one possible meaning would be "water bear" or "holy bear" and it could mean something like "Bear River"
There does seem a lot of debate about the meaning based on where you look. Then there is this possibility as the Conwy was originally known as the Cynwy meaning Chief Water https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conwy which is bourne out by several sources other than Wikipedia. Now, if we go by what is said about Conwy that the "wy" was originally "gwy" we can add the "o" and the word ogwy is created https://books.google.com/books?id=IuEGAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA285&lpg=PA285&dq=ogwy+means&source=bl&ots=lbK_5KCF2W&sig=C4pudenuzjUkclBzTmr_KSKIPL4&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiL8OmXr9PeAhWIVN8KHfjJDVMQ6AEwAXoECFkQAQ#v=onepage&q=ogwy%20means&f=false which is translated as "the moving or stirring water" which fits perfectly for a river and names with a water meaning.
I'm no expert by any means. I was looking for the meaning of onwy myself after finding the meaning of Math to be bear. So, the translation could be "Bear of the Stirring Waters"
it's as good as any other guess but it does seem to make sense.
There does seem a lot of debate about the meaning based on where you look. Then there is this possibility as the Conwy was originally known as the Cynwy meaning Chief Water https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conwy which is bourne out by several sources other than Wikipedia. Now, if we go by what is said about Conwy that the "wy" was originally "gwy" we can add the "o" and the word ogwy is created https://books.google.com/books?id=IuEGAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA285&lpg=PA285&dq=ogwy+means&source=bl&ots=lbK_5KCF2W&sig=C4pudenuzjUkclBzTmr_KSKIPL4&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiL8OmXr9PeAhWIVN8KHfjJDVMQ6AEwAXoECFkQAQ#v=onepage&q=ogwy%20means&f=false which is translated as "the moving or stirring water" which fits perfectly for a river and names with a water meaning.
I'm no expert by any means. I was looking for the meaning of onwy myself after finding the meaning of Math to be bear. So, the translation could be "Bear of the Stirring Waters"
it's as good as any other guess but it does seem to make sense.
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on and wy are diminutive endings.
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http://www.cyberwitch.com/Wychwood/PlantBran/tax.htm
The name Math is obviously a part of MATHonwy. He is, therefore, an extruded, exteriorised or externalised part of Mathonwy. Math is the nasal mutation of the Welsh 'bath' which means a coin, and a coin is the medium by which payment is made - another fact to be held in memory at this point. To equate Math with 'treasure', as is sometimes done, is over simplification and of spurious validity when analysed thus.
The remaining part of Mathonwy as yet unexplained is 'onwy'. Remembering that 'on' (the ash [tree]) was symbolic of The Great Mother Goddess and knowing that 'wy' is Welsh for 'egg', we now realise that Math is the extruded part of the egg or seed of the ash - brother of the Cosmic Goddess in her latent or virgin state (an embryonic ash) prior to her flowering into maturity and motherhood which brought forth manifestation.
The name Math is obviously a part of MATHonwy. He is, therefore, an extruded, exteriorised or externalised part of Mathonwy. Math is the nasal mutation of the Welsh 'bath' which means a coin, and a coin is the medium by which payment is made - another fact to be held in memory at this point. To equate Math with 'treasure', as is sometimes done, is over simplification and of spurious validity when analysed thus.
The remaining part of Mathonwy as yet unexplained is 'onwy'. Remembering that 'on' (the ash [tree]) was symbolic of The Great Mother Goddess and knowing that 'wy' is Welsh for 'egg', we now realise that Math is the extruded part of the egg or seed of the ash - brother of the Cosmic Goddess in her latent or virgin state (an embryonic ash) prior to her flowering into maturity and motherhood which brought forth manifestation.
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Thanks to both... Now...
Somewhere I read that "Ventie Slav" (More Glory) went on to Wenceslas then Wenzeslaus and then the welsh "Gwenddolau". But this does not convinces me fully... Anyone knows what could "dolau" stand for? (the "gwen" is simple prefix for "fair, bright, white, pure" as I understand)... Thanks in advance and bye.
Somewhere I read that "Ventie Slav" (More Glory) went on to Wenceslas then Wenzeslaus and then the welsh "Gwenddolau". But this does not convinces me fully... Anyone knows what could "dolau" stand for? (the "gwen" is simple prefix for "fair, bright, white, pure" as I understand)... Thanks in advance and bye.
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You are thanking youself ?
Mathemathix the fix (guest, 200.106.79.209)
Gianfranco E. Tubino Bryce (guest, 200.106.79.209)
Mathemathix the fix (guest, 200.106.79.209)
Gianfranco E. Tubino Bryce (guest, 200.106.79.209)
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LOL... :$
me descubriste magia... es que... quería corregir lo que dije y añadir algo más sin que se note que al final yo mismo encontré lo que pedí (larga historia)... así que de ese modo disimulé :$ no vi que se guarda el número de id... y además agaradecí a Merriment por lo suyo... pero... Above all I was thanking Merriment (the message in Spanish is for Magia)
me descubriste magia... es que... quería corregir lo que dije y añadir algo más sin que se note que al final yo mismo encontré lo que pedí (larga historia)... así que de ese modo disimulé :$ no vi que se guarda el número de id... y además agaradecí a Merriment por lo suyo... pero... Above all I was thanking Merriment (the message in Spanish is for Magia)
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vos estás del tomate...
But not to worry, just try to watch it with the multiple posting names. It is agaisnt the rules.
But not to worry, just try to watch it with the multiple posting names. It is agaisnt the rules.
This message was edited 11/21/2004, 8:51 AM
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